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and the fiscal cliff negotiations are not going well at all. on thursday republicans leaked the white house's opening bid and we have some exclusive tape of that. >> all right. somebody will have to play a little game. we'll play yours. so let's just say that you paid me because it is in your interest to pay me. but i want your answer and the money by noon tomorrow. >> senator, you can have my answer now, if you like. my offer is this -- nothing. >> okay. maybe that's not actually exclusive tape of the budget negotiations, but it is kind of the spirit of the thing. president obama's opening bid to the republicans goes like this. first democrats get a trillion dollars in tax revenue by letting the high-income bush tax expire. that hatch matches the spending cuts in the 2011 debt ceiling deal. a trillion for a trillion. then democrats and republicans get 6 billion worth of stuff they want. democrats get 6 billion from tax reform and republicans get 600 billion in spending cuts of which 350 billion comes from medicare and other health problems and
and the fiscal cliff negotiations are not going well at all. on thursday republicans leaked the white house's opening bid and we have some exclusive tape of that. >> all right. somebody will have to play a little game. we'll play yours. so let's just say that you paid me because it is in your interest to pay me. but i want your answer and the money by noon tomorrow. >> senator, you can have my answer now, if you like. my offer is this -- nothing. >> okay. maybe that's not...
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. >> there are now 29 days until the country reaches the so-called fiscal cliff. and only 19 of those are business days. as yet there's been no counteroffer from the gop but today "the wall street journal" advises republicans to say the course writing given the political difficulty of reforming entitlements republicans are right to try get mr. obama's fingerprints on a deal this year. if mr. obama won't agree to these demin muss reforms republicans should let mr. obama own the debt crisis he has done so much to create. conservative commentator bill crystal says they're making a dangerous gamble. >> republicans are at risk in my view now of looking like they're defending, keeping the current tax rates for the wealthy. end of the day president obama is selling a simple message, i want to keep taxes low for middle-class americans and republicans look like -- i'm worried are in the position offiof ing -- looking as fe the don't care about middle class. >> joining us is the sage of capitol hill, boat shoe enthusiast and celebrity doppelganger, nbc's luke russert. >> go
. >> there are now 29 days until the country reaches the so-called fiscal cliff. and only 19 of those are business days. as yet there's been no counteroffer from the gop but today "the wall street journal" advises republicans to say the course writing given the political difficulty of reforming entitlements republicans are right to try get mr. obama's fingerprints on a deal this year. if mr. obama won't agree to these demin muss reforms republicans should let mr. obama own the...
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congressman, steve israel, on the democratic momentum on the fiscal cliff. plus. >> karen finney on the new bizarre attack on ambassador, susan rice. >> all of the sudden, we are the bell of the ball. we are here to say, it's time to start to dance. >>> latino voters help put president obama over the top. now, the hispanic caucus says they want action. representative luis gutierrez joins me tonight. >>> good to have you with us. thanks for watching. president obama is selling his economic agenda and using all the right tools. the president was surrounded today by middle class taxpayers at the white house as he pushed for an extension of the tax cuts for income below $250,000. he quas quick to highlight the break in the ranks with the republicans. >> i am glad to see, if you've been reading the papers lately, that more and more republicans in congress, seem to be agreeing with this idea that we should have a balanced approach. so if both parties agree we should not raise taxes on middle class families, let's begin our work with where we agree. >> president ob
congressman, steve israel, on the democratic momentum on the fiscal cliff. plus. >> karen finney on the new bizarre attack on ambassador, susan rice. >> all of the sudden, we are the bell of the ball. we are here to say, it's time to start to dance. >>> latino voters help put president obama over the top. now, the hispanic caucus says they want action. representative luis gutierrez joins me tonight. >>> good to have you with us. thanks for watching. president obama...
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cliff discussions by folding the debt ceiling into fiscal cliff talks. take a listen. >> obama: congress, in any way suggests that they're going to tie negotiations to debt ceiling votes and take us to the brink of default once again as part of a budget negotiation which by the way we have never done in our history until we did it last year, i will not play that game. >> jennifer: fortunately for us "newsweek" "daily beast" special correspondent michael tomasky is always up for playing political games himself. he's joining us from washington d.c. thanks for coming back inside "the war room." >> it is always my pleasure, governor. >> jennifer: always a pleasure to have you. so let me talk about this debt ceiling issue. because really, as we look at it really, the only leverage that republicans have on the fiscal cliff talks they proceed to be with the debt limit right? so today the treasury department ups the ante by endorsing republican senator mitch mcconnell's summer 2011 provision which, you know, he suggested and it effectively lets the president rai
cliff discussions by folding the debt ceiling into fiscal cliff talks. take a listen. >> obama: congress, in any way suggests that they're going to tie negotiations to debt ceiling votes and take us to the brink of default once again as part of a budget negotiation which by the way we have never done in our history until we did it last year, i will not play that game. >> jennifer: fortunately for us "newsweek" "daily beast" special correspondent michael tomasky...
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. >> jennifer: president obama took his fiscal cliff avoidance campaign to corporate executives today. those top leaders may be small in number but they're actually very extra large in influence and during his address the president's address to the business roundtable which is a bunch of ceos of the biggest corporations president obama had this message for republicans who were plotting to gain leverage over the fiscal cliff discussions by folding the debt ceiling into fiscal cliff talks. take a listen. >> obama: congress, in any way suggests that they're going to tie negotiations to debt ceiling votes and take us to the brink of default once again as part of a budget negotiation which by the way we have never done in our history until we did it last year i will not play that game. >> jennifer: fortunately for us "newsweek" "daily beast" special correspondent michael tomasky is always up for playing political games himself. he's joining us from washington d.c. thanks for coming back inside "the war room." >> it is always my pleasure, governor. >> jennifer: always a pleasure to have you
. >> jennifer: president obama took his fiscal cliff avoidance campaign to corporate executives today. those top leaders may be small in number but they're actually very extra large in influence and during his address the president's address to the business roundtable which is a bunch of ceos of the biggest corporations president obama had this message for republicans who were plotting to gain leverage over the fiscal cliff discussions by folding the debt ceiling into fiscal cliff talks....
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yes, you have the business wing, the wall street wing, that wants a deal for the fiscal cliff because they're looking at their pocketbooks. you still have this hard ride evangelical wings and that tea party wings. those two things still have a lot of sway, and they still want the kind of candidates that are like herman cain. they still think people like even john boehner are too moderate. even though boehner is putting forward essentially the mitt romney economic plan as his supposed compromise with the president. that's not far right enough for a big chunk of the republican base. >> maria, let me play for you something one of the outcast congressmen tossed by speaker boehner said today. listen to this. >> it's not about principles. it's about blind obedience. dissent will not be tolerated, particularly conservative dissent. >> he was upset throughout that forum today. is conservative blogger eric ericsson, he writes this. conservatives must seek retribution or become the paper tiger. maria, what will the retribution look like? >> i think we're all a little scared of that. >> i am. >>
yes, you have the business wing, the wall street wing, that wants a deal for the fiscal cliff because they're looking at their pocketbooks. you still have this hard ride evangelical wings and that tea party wings. those two things still have a lot of sway, and they still want the kind of candidates that are like herman cain. they still think people like even john boehner are too moderate. even though boehner is putting forward essentially the mitt romney economic plan as his supposed compromise...
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. >>> democrats said they think it's a good idea to drive the economy off the fiscal cliff this january. you might call this thelma and louise economics. right off the cliff. ♪ >> joining me now, senator feldma. >> great to talk to you. >> senator, you've been the leader on how the democrats should be approaching the so-called off the cliff drama and i just want to play something you said on july 16th at the brookings institute. let's listen to that. >> we can't get a good deal, a balanced deal that calls on the wealthy to pay their fair share, when i will absolutely continue this debate into 2013. >> after that, senator mcconnell called that thelma and louise economics. tell us why this cliff is not as disastrous a cliff to go off? >> first of all, no one wants to go off any cliff or hill or slope. there is a responsible way to revolve this. but if we take a bad deal and say that all of the nation's fiscal problems are to be balanced on the back of middle class families and the wealthy don't participate, that's a bad deal we cannot and should not live within this country. >> shortly
. >>> democrats said they think it's a good idea to drive the economy off the fiscal cliff this january. you might call this thelma and louise economics. right off the cliff. ♪ >> joining me now, senator feldma. >> great to talk to you. >> senator, you've been the leader on how the democrats should be approaching the so-called off the cliff drama and i just want to play something you said on july 16th at the brookings institute. let's listen to that. >> we...
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cliff, rather, and if they don't, it could harm consumer can ha confidence and in turn businesses like this one in pennsylvania. but, chris, also expect republicans to sort of lob a counterpunch today. i expect them to sort of highlight a business nearby that could be harmed if taxes do go up on those making $250,000 or more because, of course, that is for some small businesses their budget level. chris? >> and one thing, a quick follow-up, did the white house -- do you have any indication did the white house expect the reaction they got on capitol hill yesterday? i assume with this proposal, which much of it isn't new. this is essentially the president's budget proposal from last year, that they didn't think john boehner was going to say, that sounds good, let's do that. but did they expect the dismissiveness and john boehner's tone in his press conference yesterday? did that catch them by surprise at all? >> reporter: well, i think the white house democrats were a little surprised by the backlash but, as you point out, this budget proposal is essentially what the president proposed l
cliff, rather, and if they don't, it could harm consumer can ha confidence and in turn businesses like this one in pennsylvania. but, chris, also expect republicans to sort of lob a counterpunch today. i expect them to sort of highlight a business nearby that could be harmed if taxes do go up on those making $250,000 or more because, of course, that is for some small businesses their budget level. chris? >> and one thing, a quick follow-up, did the white house -- do you have any...
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that's it from cnbc, first in business worldwide. now back to "hardball." >>> back to "hardball." let's take making a deal here for all that at home who want to see republicans and democrats work together to avoid the fiscal cliff, we can bring you two lawmakers who are open to cutting a deal before the end of the year. with me are members from both sides of the aisle u.s. congressman lee tori, a republican from nebraska, and u.s. congressman jerry conley a democrat from nearby southern virginia. but first, i want to start with you. you told the omaha world herald this about republicans, we're screwed either way we have no leverage in these discussions. congressman, what did you mean by that? >> what i mean by that is that the president wants us to take a tax vote before he's willing to talk about anything else cutting or reforming, and republicans just aren't going to do that. so what he's doing is setting us up to be the fall people for going over the fiscal cliff. frankly, going over the fiscal cliff is a win for the president. so either way we're going to get it. >> but i don'
that's it from cnbc, first in business worldwide. now back to "hardball." >>> back to "hardball." let's take making a deal here for all that at home who want to see republicans and democrats work together to avoid the fiscal cliff, we can bring you two lawmakers who are open to cutting a deal before the end of the year. with me are members from both sides of the aisle u.s. congressman lee tori, a republican from nebraska, and u.s. congressman jerry conley a democrat...
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and even as a small business person, everyone talks about what the fiscal cliff could do to small business, what obama care can do for small business, but you said we shouldn't worry about that so much, that we should get some sort of compromise in order to keep moving and keep talking and keep moving forward? >> well, i think that it was pretty clear during the course of the election and since and even in the president's speech today where he said he's willing to give on some revenue and some spending cuts, he's proposed some, he's already passed some into law. and beyond that, just from my perspective, what i see is that we know that we're a confidence-based economy, we're 70% of the economy driven by consumer spending and anything that puts a crimp in consumer spending is not good for the economy. so to put a tax rise, a tax rate increase for the middle class makes no sense to me. someone who makes 50, 60, $70,000 a year will lose and will take away a lot of discretionary purchases from people like me and travel and a whole host of other areas. i hope our leaders in washington are liste
and even as a small business person, everyone talks about what the fiscal cliff could do to small business, what obama care can do for small business, but you said we shouldn't worry about that so much, that we should get some sort of compromise in order to keep moving and keep talking and keep moving forward? >> well, i think that it was pretty clear during the course of the election and since and even in the president's speech today where he said he's willing to give on some revenue and...
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but going over the fiscal cliff is serious business. and i'm here seriously trying to resolve it. and i would hope the white house would get serious as well. >> we can debate at length whether the november 6th election was a mandate, but i don't think we can debate the basics that it was a work order, a work order from the american people to members of congress and to the president, roll up your sleeves, work together and solve the problems. we got the message. did speaker boehner get the message? because the message was work together. what we hear from him is all of his pain and frustration and angst dealing with the tea party in his own caucus. well, there comes a point when he needs to look beyond his caucus to the house and to the nation. >> all right. welcome back to "morning joe." >> i guess the more things change, the more they stay the same. it's depressing, you're right, harold, we've seen this movie before. this was a year ago. this happened a year ago. and i know the media says oh, it's the republicans' fault any time the house doesn't completely fold into what the pres
but going over the fiscal cliff is serious business. and i'm here seriously trying to resolve it. and i would hope the white house would get serious as well. >> we can debate at length whether the november 6th election was a mandate, but i don't think we can debate the basics that it was a work order, a work order from the american people to members of congress and to the president, roll up your sleeves, work together and solve the problems. we got the message. did speaker boehner get the...
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cliff. but his actions have not matched his public statements. members of his own party seem quite comfortable with sending the economy over the fiscal cliff. >> the speaker's remarks riled the left and provoked this response from senate majority leader harry reid. >> he says that democrats have got to get serious about cuts, spending cuts. where is the disconnect, then? >> i don't understand his brain, so you should ask him. okay? >> with only a handful of legislative days left on the congress's calendar before the looming fiscal cliff becomes a raw reality, will the president and house gop find a way over the latest road black and back to the bargaining table? >> why did the white house decide to have this as their opening volley when they knew the response would be a negative one that they drew? >> was it hardball opening? yeah, of course it was. the question is, what's the counteroffer? >> i would imagine there has to -- tim geithner is too smart of a guy in this administration is filled
cliff. but his actions have not matched his public statements. members of his own party seem quite comfortable with sending the economy over the fiscal cliff. >> the speaker's remarks riled the left and provoked this response from senate majority leader harry reid. >> he says that democrats have got to get serious about cuts, spending cuts. where is the disconnect, then? >> i don't understand his brain, so you should ask him. okay? >> with only a handful of legislative...
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. >>> the fight over the fiscal cliff is having an affect on small businesses right now. just as congress, the people running those businesses, they're not agreeing on a solution, but poppy harlow, she's got the perspective from the folks who are suffering. >> if any company, any business did the method of accounting as the government sdshgs we would be in jail. >> you sound like you've had it? >> yes, basically i have. >> debt is a cancer. that's what bob told me when we met him at his limousine company in freehold, new jersey. stoo here's the reservations. staffed 24 hours a day. >> reporter: he started the business back in 1984. today he has a staff of 75. 53 cars. one big question. >> i just want congress to tell me to come up with what the boundaries are so i know -- i know how to run my business. i know how to plan. >> he has laid off four employees in the last six months. he says the business made it through the stock market crash of 1987, the savings and loan crisis, and 9/11 with no decline in revenue until the financial crisis of 2008 and now this. >> could more
. >>> the fight over the fiscal cliff is having an affect on small businesses right now. just as congress, the people running those businesses, they're not agreeing on a solution, but poppy harlow, she's got the perspective from the folks who are suffering. >> if any company, any business did the method of accounting as the government sdshgs we would be in jail. >> you sound like you've had it? >> yes, basically i have. >> debt is a cancer. that's what bob told...
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cliff is serious business. and i'm here seriously trying to resolve it. and i would hope the white house would get serious as well. >> speaker boehner made very clear at his press conference that he thinks the ball is in your court and the president's court. he says democrats have got to get series about spending cuts. where is the disconnect? >> i don't understand his brain so you should ask him. okay? >> reid making those comments to our own kate bolduan. i'm joined by dan lothian. dan, we're learning more about the white house plan to deal with the fiscal cliff. break it down for us. >> reporter: right. this is the plan that secretary -- treasury secretary timothy geithner took up to capitol hill yesterday. it calls for $1.6 trillion in tax increases over a ten-year period more than republicans had anticipated. in addition to that, $400 billion in spending cuts that will come later. much of that not really specified. we're looking at entitlements such as medicare. and then the plan also includes $50 billion
cliff is serious business. and i'm here seriously trying to resolve it. and i would hope the white house would get serious as well. >> speaker boehner made very clear at his press conference that he thinks the ball is in your court and the president's court. he says democrats have got to get series about spending cuts. where is the disconnect? >> i don't understand his brain so you should ask him. okay? >> reid making those comments to our own kate bolduan. i'm joined by dan...
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is it going to be easier to get bipartisan view on immigration or on the fiscal cliff? they're both very important in terms of getting business moving. >> i think there's more after consensus on immigration than on the fiscal cliff. >> let's talk about taxing overseas profits only where they are earned. explain that. >> well, that's really something where the united states is an outlier and the argument here is bring them back where they're earned. at the moment the problem is american companies have lots of money sitting overseas because they don't want to bring it back and be taxed in the united states. so that is something that puts as one of his eight points because it is holding back investments by american companies. >> all right. the new issue of "the economist" is "the world in 2013." daniel franklin. thank you so much for being on the show this morning. stay with us. much more on "morning joe." ♪ ♪ mom? dad? guys? [ engine turns over ] [ engine revs ] ♪ he'll be fine. [ male announcer ] more people are leaving bmw, mercedes and lexus for audi than ever be
is it going to be easier to get bipartisan view on immigration or on the fiscal cliff? they're both very important in terms of getting business moving. >> i think there's more after consensus on immigration than on the fiscal cliff. >> let's talk about taxing overseas profits only where they are earned. explain that. >> well, that's really something where the united states is an outlier and the argument here is bring them back where they're earned. at the moment the problem is...
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but going over the fiscal cliff is serious business. and i'm here seriously trying to resolve it. and i would hope the white house would get serious as well. >> reporter: house democratic leader nancy pelosi quickly dismissed boehner's remarks as a negotiating maneuver. >> i think they'll come around. it's a tactic. it's a tactic. >> reporter: but you hear a strikingly similar message from other top democratic leaders saying the ball is in the republicans' court. >> we are waiting for some specifics somewhere from our republican colleagues to show that they're serious on negotiations. >> reporter: as the country fast approaches the fiscal cliff, the two sides are talking past each other. democrats say they've laid down their marker hiking tax rates on wealthier americans. and it's up to republicans to propose specific spending cuts they want to entitlement programs. however, republicans say they've offered a concession putting revenue on the table. and they say it's now up to the president and his fellow democrats to feel some pain and propose cuts in medicare and medicaid. confu
but going over the fiscal cliff is serious business. and i'm here seriously trying to resolve it. and i would hope the white house would get serious as well. >> reporter: house democratic leader nancy pelosi quickly dismissed boehner's remarks as a negotiating maneuver. >> i think they'll come around. it's a tactic. it's a tactic. >> reporter: but you hear a strikingly similar message from other top democratic leaders saying the ball is in the republicans' court. >> we...